Subject
Re: Fwd: TT-10,13, 14,15 (fwd) thank heavens
From
Date
Body
Akiko,
I think it was Carolyn Kunin who called our attention to the distinction
between "heaven" and "sky" - which may not occur in the romance languages.
Are there two different words in Russian? I don´t think there is a
distinction in German, either.
Is this worth pursuing?
Jansy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Donald B. Johnson" <chtodel@gss.ucsb.edu>
To: <NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU>
Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: TT-10,13, 14,15 (fwd) thank heavens
> Thank you all who posted on "thank heavens." I did not think the idiom
would
> be so tricky, but it is very interesting.
>
> I wonder which could be possible:
> 1) VN found "Thank Heavens!" natural as Don, even if used by Julia, a New
> Yorker, and did not accept the editor's suggestion that it be changed to
> "Thank Heaven!"
> 2) VN found it wrong as Eric, or unnatural for Julia, and intentionally
made
> it "Heavens" to draw the reader's attention to it so that the reader would
> ask "Who is narrating?"
>
> If 2) is the case, I think it is probably Armande rather than Mr. R. who
> speaks. As Carolyn and an anonymous contributor taught, she might say
> "heavens" thinking about the word in plural like "cieux." It is too
> difficult for me, but an astute reader could be aware of it as it comes
> after "l'Erale Tribune." As Mary wrote, Mr. R. might have misheard or
> misquoted it, though.
>
> I could not find the idiom in VN's other novels. Does he use it anywhere?
>
> Akiko
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Donald B. Johnson" <chtodel@gss.ucsb.edu>
> To: <NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU>
> Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 4:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Fwd: TT-10,13, 14,15 (fwd) thank heavens
>
>
> > Dear Akiko:
> >
> > This may be regional or generational, but Thank heavens definitely
> sounds
> > wrong to me. I would have said it is a confusion of various idioms --
> i.e.
> > heavens to Betsy! But a Google search turns up many hits, including the
> > Dixie Chicks' song Thank heavens for Dale Evans. I still think,
though --
> > and this is in contrast to Don -- that in the context "My former
> > stepfather, thank Heavens" -- the plural is "off", and that "Thank
> heavens"
> > is more likely in a longer sentence. But I'm not as sure as I was...
> > Eric
> >
> >
> > >Dear Eric,
> > >
> > >Thanks very much for resending your comments.
> > >
> > >I am still puzzled by "thank heavens." I understand the idiom is
> originally
> > >"thank heaven," but is it wrong as "to make a story short" is? Some
> English
> > >dictionaries give "thank heaven(s)." Cobuild English Dictionary for
> Advanced
> > >Learners and Longman Advanced American Dictionary (probably more)
contain
> > >"thank God, heavens, goodness," omitting "thank heaven." Does "thank
> > >heavens" sound strange to most native speakers of English?
> > >
> > >Best,
> > >Akiko
> > >
> > >
> > >> on chapter 13
> > >> 45 - "My former stepfather, thank Heavens" Julia is parodying R.,
"who
> > >> had an exasperating way not only of trotting out hackneyed formulas
in
> his
> > >> would-be colloquial thickly accented English, but also of getting
them
> > >> wrong)"
> > >
> > >> Eric
> > >
> > >----- End forwarded message -----
> > >
> > >EDCOMMENT. To my ear, "Thank heavenS" seems more natural. "Thank
Heaven"
> > >seems
> > >to call for some specific object, i.e., "Thank Heaven for little girls"
> as
> > >Maurice Chevalier (& HH?) used to sing.
> >
> > ----- End forwarded message -----
>
> ----- End forwarded message -----
>
>
----- End forwarded message -----
I think it was Carolyn Kunin who called our attention to the distinction
between "heaven" and "sky" - which may not occur in the romance languages.
Are there two different words in Russian? I don´t think there is a
distinction in German, either.
Is this worth pursuing?
Jansy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Donald B. Johnson" <chtodel@gss.ucsb.edu>
To: <NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU>
Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 1:57 PM
Subject: Re: Fwd: TT-10,13, 14,15 (fwd) thank heavens
> Thank you all who posted on "thank heavens." I did not think the idiom
would
> be so tricky, but it is very interesting.
>
> I wonder which could be possible:
> 1) VN found "Thank Heavens!" natural as Don, even if used by Julia, a New
> Yorker, and did not accept the editor's suggestion that it be changed to
> "Thank Heaven!"
> 2) VN found it wrong as Eric, or unnatural for Julia, and intentionally
made
> it "Heavens" to draw the reader's attention to it so that the reader would
> ask "Who is narrating?"
>
> If 2) is the case, I think it is probably Armande rather than Mr. R. who
> speaks. As Carolyn and an anonymous contributor taught, she might say
> "heavens" thinking about the word in plural like "cieux." It is too
> difficult for me, but an astute reader could be aware of it as it comes
> after "l'Erale Tribune." As Mary wrote, Mr. R. might have misheard or
> misquoted it, though.
>
> I could not find the idiom in VN's other novels. Does he use it anywhere?
>
> Akiko
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Donald B. Johnson" <chtodel@gss.ucsb.edu>
> To: <NABOKV-L@LISTSERV.UCSB.EDU>
> Sent: Friday, September 17, 2004 4:49 AM
> Subject: Re: Fwd: TT-10,13, 14,15 (fwd) thank heavens
>
>
> > Dear Akiko:
> >
> > This may be regional or generational, but Thank heavens definitely
> sounds
> > wrong to me. I would have said it is a confusion of various idioms --
> i.e.
> > heavens to Betsy! But a Google search turns up many hits, including the
> > Dixie Chicks' song Thank heavens for Dale Evans. I still think,
though --
> > and this is in contrast to Don -- that in the context "My former
> > stepfather, thank Heavens" -- the plural is "off", and that "Thank
> heavens"
> > is more likely in a longer sentence. But I'm not as sure as I was...
> > Eric
> >
> >
> > >Dear Eric,
> > >
> > >Thanks very much for resending your comments.
> > >
> > >I am still puzzled by "thank heavens." I understand the idiom is
> originally
> > >"thank heaven," but is it wrong as "to make a story short" is? Some
> English
> > >dictionaries give "thank heaven(s)." Cobuild English Dictionary for
> Advanced
> > >Learners and Longman Advanced American Dictionary (probably more)
contain
> > >"thank God, heavens, goodness," omitting "thank heaven." Does "thank
> > >heavens" sound strange to most native speakers of English?
> > >
> > >Best,
> > >Akiko
> > >
> > >
> > >> on chapter 13
> > >> 45 - "My former stepfather, thank Heavens" Julia is parodying R.,
"who
> > >> had an exasperating way not only of trotting out hackneyed formulas
in
> his
> > >> would-be colloquial thickly accented English, but also of getting
them
> > >> wrong)"
> > >
> > >> Eric
> > >
> > >----- End forwarded message -----
> > >
> > >EDCOMMENT. To my ear, "Thank heavenS" seems more natural. "Thank
Heaven"
> > >seems
> > >to call for some specific object, i.e., "Thank Heaven for little girls"
> as
> > >Maurice Chevalier (& HH?) used to sing.
> >
> > ----- End forwarded message -----
>
> ----- End forwarded message -----
>
>
----- End forwarded message -----